Catching Up With Kieran Over Coffee About Cronulla (28/10/24)

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[00:02:17] Hey there, good morning. Welcome to SharkCastPod, a podcast dedicated to the greatest sporting club in the history of the world,

[00:02:24] the mighty Cronulla Sutherland Sharks.

[00:02:25] This is catching up with Kieran Overcoffee about Cronulla, one of our franchises of SharkCastPod,

[00:02:31] which has just exploded this year due to Kieran's popularity and his great takes on the sharks and other things in life.

[00:02:39] And the show is brought to you by Dyson Logistics, the Royal Motor Yacht Club in Port Hacking,

[00:02:42] and Jason Hawes at Crips & Crips Real Estate.

[00:02:44] I am Sam Shnazzi, OG2015, supporting a hell of a lot longer than that.

[00:02:49] And Kieran is on the other end of the line.

[00:02:51] Kieran, are you up to date with TV and in specifics,

[00:02:56] Sharks fanatic Brendan Cowell's Plum series recorded around our local streets?

[00:03:01] Have you watched it?

[00:03:02] No, I haven't seen any of it. Is it, it's out now, is it?

[00:03:06] What world are you, what rock are you living under?

[00:03:08] Which, tell me about this rock you live under.

[00:03:11] Yeah, it's out. There's been two episodes on the ABC Sunday night, but you can watch it all on their iview app, I think it's called.

[00:03:19] And it's based on a book which came out, I can't believe I'm telling you about this,

[00:03:23] it's a book that came out a couple of years ago, an amazing book which I read when it was released.

[00:03:28] And a good friend of the show, hopefully he's coming on to talk about it in the coming weeks.

[00:03:32] But it's essentially about a retired footballer with CTE concerns, and with a kid coming through the grade,

[00:03:39] and it's all based in the show I read about Cronulla.

[00:03:41] Oh wow.

[00:03:42] It's fictional, but based on some people you may have grown up watching.

[00:03:45] And there's cameos in the show, and it's awesome.

[00:03:48] So I can't believe you don't know about this, I'm not putting shade on you, I'm just saying it's out there.

[00:03:53] And yeah, people should get behind it, because it's a really great Australian show.

[00:03:57] And the other thing I was going to say was, before we jump into Rugby League,

[00:04:02] have you seen the Netflix show, Nobody Wants This, with Seth and Veronica Mars?

[00:04:08] No, I don't even know who Seth or Veronica Mars is.

[00:04:11] What?

[00:04:12] Am I living in some sort of alternate world?

[00:04:14] What's going on?

[00:04:16] You watch The O.C., I know this for a fact.

[00:04:18] Oh, I did watch The O.C. when I was younger, that is correct.

[00:04:21] Seth's in a show.

[00:04:22] Oh, okay.

[00:04:23] And Seth's in a show with Veronica Mars, who is a fictional character,

[00:04:28] but her real name is Kristen Bell, this amazing actress.

[00:04:31] And they've made this show, and it's unbelievable.

[00:04:33] It's the best show I've seen in like five years.

[00:04:34] Nobody wants this.

[00:04:35] I haven't really watched a lot of TV recently, because again,

[00:04:39] most of my time is taken up watching sports.

[00:04:41] So we did watch one of the things on the Menendez brothers recently on Netflix,

[00:04:46] which was pretty crazy.

[00:04:47] Yes.

[00:04:48] And that was really taking up a lot of our nights.

[00:04:50] Now, did you watch the miniseries or the doco?

[00:04:53] I watched the miniseries.

[00:04:54] I think we're going to watch the documentary tonight.

[00:04:56] Doco is way better.

[00:04:57] Yeah.

[00:04:57] Well, I didn't realize the miniseries was by the same people that did Dharma the year

[00:05:02] before.

[00:05:02] And I just, I didn't know anything about the Menendez brothers or the whole case.

[00:05:06] Again, again, what rock are you living under, bro?

[00:05:08] Oh my God.

[00:05:10] So that was a wild journey for me, man.

[00:05:12] Oh yeah, yeah.

[00:05:13] It's fascinating.

[00:05:13] It's been fascinating since it happened.

[00:05:15] And yeah, there's news breaking last few days that they might be getting out.

[00:05:21] We'll see what happens.

[00:05:22] Depends what side you're on, who you believe.

[00:05:24] Anyway, we're here to talk about rugby league before we get the hate mail.

[00:05:28] Rugby league.

[00:05:29] Here we go.

[00:05:30] We're going to focus today on November 1st, which is coming around any day now pretty

[00:05:35] much.

[00:05:36] And you're particularly obsessed with play contracts out of the two of us.

[00:05:41] So I'm obviously very, very interested in it.

[00:05:43] And we both have the same beef about the fact that it's so ridiculous that you can sign a

[00:05:47] player at a certain time and then you got to wait.

[00:05:51] But importantly, we have a lot of players off contract that need to fit into the puzzle.

[00:05:56] And we touched on it in the last episode, but we thought we'd sink our teeth into it

[00:06:00] this week.

[00:06:02] So how do you want to go about this?

[00:06:04] Kieran, do you want to go just names we can see in front of us?

[00:06:07] Do you want to pick out guys?

[00:06:08] Tell me how you want to run through it.

[00:06:10] I think let's go through the Sharks players that are off contract and then maybe let's

[00:06:14] have a think about what plays could you potentially bring in that could provide some sort of a difference

[00:06:20] for us because given the amount of quality that we've got coming off contract, it is going

[00:06:25] to be very difficult to keep them all.

[00:06:27] So you will need to have to go to the market.

[00:06:28] We would, I would think to try and get some of these other players to backfill them.

[00:06:33] What a busy summer for our coaching staff and for our recruitment people that are only going

[00:06:39] to keep players.

[00:06:40] They're going to go buy them as well.

[00:06:41] All right.

[00:06:43] Dan Atkinson off contract handy little shark ended up playing a very important role for us,

[00:06:51] particularly in the halves when needed for both, uh, Nico missing.

[00:06:56] And of course, Braden Trindle as well.

[00:06:58] Are you keeping Dan Atkinson or are you letting him go to start with?

[00:07:03] I think he's, he's definitely somebody that we would want to keep, right?

[00:07:08] I think it's going to be interesting to see what the market is for him because that was

[00:07:13] his first year in first grade where he was, you know, a proper, you know, first grader,

[00:07:19] right?

[00:07:19] So it's going to be interesting to see if you're a club out there right now that needs

[00:07:24] a genuine half, or maybe they view him as that utility player.

[00:07:27] Um, what dollar figure that they would actually place on a guy like him because he, he did

[00:07:32] step up and play some really good games and, and, you know, which was quite important for

[00:07:36] us in feeling a number of roles.

[00:07:37] So I don't think he's going to get insane money, but I think he's going to get fair money.

[00:07:44] And I, there is probably a way that we could work out how to keep him.

[00:07:48] I'm just not sure what that looks like.

[00:07:50] And I do think you're always going to be worth more to somebody else than you are to your current employer.

[00:07:54] That's true in, in all facts of work, I think.

[00:07:57] So it's going to be interesting one to see where we, where he lands.

[00:08:01] I have no idea what he's on right now, but I'm guessing he's probably on the lower tier of the salary cap.

[00:08:08] So in terms of an upgrade, I don't know what that looks like percentage wise, but I mean, I guess the question is, do you think he would be our starting half in 2026?

[00:08:21] And that's where you have to make your decision on.

[00:08:23] To answer that question, it would be a no because the starting halves would be Heinz and Trindle.

[00:08:28] Now I can tell you last year, he played 19 games, started 15.

[00:08:33] Not all of that was in the halves, but the majority of his starting was in the halves.

[00:08:38] Some handy stats, clutch player, as we know, good goal kicker as well.

[00:08:43] Yeah.

[00:08:44] And young and learning on the, on the job.

[00:08:48] Great attitude, tremendous attitude, tremendous club guy.

[00:08:52] I'm definitely, I definitely want to keep him Kieran, but we can't throw the bank at this guy, unfortunately.

[00:08:58] Well, then you got to look at like, where are the potential landing spots for him?

[00:09:01] Right.

[00:09:02] And just from looking at this off contract list that I've got in front of me, it seems like the Dolphins have guys like Sean O'Sullivan coming off contract.

[00:09:10] The Titans have Tanya Boyd, how do I say his name?

[00:09:15] Tanya Boyd and Kieran Foran off contract, right?

[00:09:18] There's obviously the Ben Hunt noise too, that he wants to return to Queensland potentially.

[00:09:23] Given that Akko is a Queenslander, those two teams could potentially be looking to acquire him.

[00:09:29] I think the Titans, when you look at probably what they're paying Sean O'Sullivan, maybe that's money.

[00:09:36] Yeah.

[00:09:36] Sorry, the Dolphins.

[00:09:37] Don't forget though, he's not a regular starter.

[00:09:39] He's not, but when he was signed, he was signed to be that regular starter with Katoa for them, right?

[00:09:47] So obviously, he hasn't been that in and out first grader every single week.

[00:09:52] It's a tough one, mate.

[00:09:53] And also too, you look at him and you go, okay, well, if he then moves on, then you've got a chance to do something with Puru.

[00:09:59] You've also got a chance to do something with young Riley Pollard, who they've got signed on contract until the end of 2027, who's in our under 20s right now.

[00:10:07] So there's a little bit of a log jam there.

[00:10:10] And obviously, we've got three NRL quality halves at the moment in our squad with Atkinson stepping up and becoming that third guy.

[00:10:17] So someone's going to have to go.

[00:10:19] It's not going to be Nico, despite what people might have their feelings on.

[00:10:24] And Trindle and Akko are off contract right now.

[00:10:26] So you can't afford to lose both of them, but it's going to be really hard to work out where we actually put the dollar figure on Akko.

[00:10:34] So if another club comes in, like the Dragons, for example, who are always in the market for players and throws a bit of cash, you know, Manly is going to be without DCE potentially as well too.

[00:10:43] So there's a few clubs that need halves.

[00:10:45] The thing is also if, and we are playing chess here, but if Trindle gets an offer for 1.1 to the Broncos or whoever, we're probably not going to give Trindle 1.1.

[00:10:55] And therefore we're like, Dan, why don't you stick around for a little bit unless they buy someone else.

[00:11:00] So there is a bit of juggling going on there, which makes me think Trindle's probably the first guy you want to re-sign to make all the pieces work.

[00:11:11] But he is going to November 1 to market.

[00:11:14] Yeah.

[00:11:15] I mean, I don't think that should be too much of a concern to Sharks fans that these players are going to November 1.

[00:11:21] This whole transfer system is an absolute joke.

[00:11:24] It's laughable.

[00:11:25] It's the most ridiculous transfer system in all of professional sports.

[00:11:28] There's nothing else like it.

[00:11:30] These players would definitely have some sort of understanding of who's in the market for them, all that type of stuff.

[00:11:35] Right. So the way the NRL works is you can have conversations with players to let them know that you are interested in acquiring them and things of that nature, but you can't submit an offer.

[00:11:47] So in theory, we could go out to Ryan Pappenhausen.

[00:11:51] Right. Because I said him last week. Right.

[00:11:52] So we can go to Pappenhausen and sort of say, look, we've got a few moving parts.

[00:11:55] We could free up some room.

[00:11:57] You know, should you make it to November 1, we would love to sit down, have a conversation with you and give you something in the vicinity or who knows.

[00:12:04] Right. I don't know if you can even say that, but there is a little bit of flexibility there.

[00:12:08] So I think Trindle would pretty much know what his options would look like right now and kind of maybe the ballparks of what those clubs would have.

[00:12:17] I think the other interesting thing here, and I don't have this information in front of me, is how many of these guys have the same player agents because that is becoming more and more of a thing.

[00:12:27] And then those player agents can hold those clubs kind of to ransom.

[00:12:30] I have done a deep dive on this in the past because I have nothing better to do in my life.

[00:12:36] We don't seem to have too many guys with the one agent.

[00:12:39] Our players are spread pretty evenly across different agents.

[00:12:43] So that's not a concern for me at the moment.

[00:12:46] But yeah.

[00:12:47] Fitzy is not going to get rolled over there either as Darren Mooney on that scenario.

[00:12:53] So I wouldn't worry about that.

[00:12:54] Now, on the list you sent me privately, Kieran, I can tell you that the Sharks,

[00:13:00] have re-signed some players which you and I have not made note of.

[00:13:04] But those players are Mawini Haradi, Nifa Peru, Bill Burns, Jaden Beryl and Chris Vaila.

[00:13:11] So they've all signed for an extra year.

[00:13:13] So we don't need to worry about those guys on our list that you and I were talking about.

[00:13:17] Let's shoot to Trindle because he's on topic for us.

[00:13:21] He's wanted by a number of clubs.

[00:13:23] Informed player.

[00:13:24] Young.

[00:13:26] Not without his troubles, but he showed that he can get past those troubles, which is great.

[00:13:29] And a very handy player.

[00:13:31] I'm of the opinion he's very rarely played bad for us.

[00:13:35] I would even suggest he doesn't have too many mediocre games.

[00:13:39] He's always above average or better.

[00:13:41] And even if you take the hype out of it and the Channel 9 guys who watch him twice a year,

[00:13:47] take all that out of it.

[00:13:49] We shouldn't hide from the fact that he's wanted by other clubs or be scared of it, as you said.

[00:13:54] We want to keep him.

[00:13:56] We just don't want to go too crazy with the money.

[00:13:59] He's definitely getting an upgrade.

[00:14:00] No one's denying that.

[00:14:02] Absolutely.

[00:14:02] It's a matter of how far you can go.

[00:14:07] And we don't know how far they can go.

[00:14:09] They can do a number of different things with their roster.

[00:14:11] It depends how much they want to keep him.

[00:14:15] We know that Fitzgibbon has always said that Trindle's a long-term option, and that belief is coming true, which is great.

[00:14:23] A lot of us were sort of on the fence.

[00:14:25] I was on the fence a little bit about it, but I can definitely see it now.

[00:14:28] Yeah, me too.

[00:14:29] So the club wants to keep him.

[00:14:32] That goes without saying.

[00:14:33] It's just a matter of whether they can match, for example, a Flanagan who is, as we know from past experience, checkbook heavy.

[00:14:40] So what do you think is going to happen?

[00:14:43] I think we'll look up Tricky for a couple of years.

[00:14:46] I think the one thing that we also need to consider is expansion, all right?

[00:14:50] And we're talking about players now and signing them on a contract for 2026.

[00:14:55] So expansion is, everyone's saying, about 2027, 2028, and then 2030, before the Olympics with Brisbane and all that type of stuff, right?

[00:15:04] So a guy like Trindle, he might have a preference where he might say, you know what, I'm on to the end of 25.

[00:15:11] Give me a 12-month extension, and then I can then go and test myself when, say, the Perth Bears coming to the competition or whatever, right?

[00:15:20] Because at that point, he'd have another two years of first grade.

[00:15:22] He's got 71 games under his belt right now.

[00:15:26] That's an injection of, you know, what's the salary cap these days, $10 million or something like that?

[00:15:30] It's going up every year, yeah.

[00:15:31] So again, basically two years' time, he can negotiate with an extra $20 million with two more teams that are in the player pool trying to buy talent, right?

[00:15:40] So you might see some of these players sign shorter deals, but the clubs will obviously have a preference to do longer deals because of this.

[00:15:48] I saw the Manly CEO during the week was talking about how they did Oluwatu and Paseca on longer-term deals because they weren't necessarily star players.

[00:15:58] But he said that these are the players that when you're building a team, those guys will be in those prime career years, and they will be heavily sought after by these new teams, right?

[00:16:06] So it's something we've really got to factor into at Trindle, for example, because right now, Tricky is he's 25 years old.

[00:16:13] He turns 26 in the middle of next season, okay?

[00:16:16] He's played 71 NRL games.

[00:16:18] So he's really starting to come into that peak, right, of where his prime years are going to be, right?

[00:16:24] So it's great that we've got him for another 12 months.

[00:16:26] My preference would be at least a three-year deal to take him out past that first window of expansion teams.

[00:16:35] So you'd lock him up there for 26, 27, 28.

[00:16:37] So then he wouldn't be able to go anywhere until the end of 29.

[00:16:41] Again, we've got Nico until the end of, I think, 27, I think it is.

[00:16:47] So he could play somewhere else in 28.

[00:16:49] That is a really long time for us to lock down our halves.

[00:16:53] And again, we have these young players coming through, right?

[00:16:56] The Pollards and Perus and all this type of stuff, right?

[00:16:58] So again, it's kind of unique to have your halves signed on long term.

[00:17:04] But I guess the stability and for the window that we're currently in that we discussed last week,

[00:17:08] you kind of want to lock up a trindle for as long as you can.

[00:17:11] So my preference, three-year deal, a decent upgrade.

[00:17:14] But again, I think once we, if the reports of him being on 400 are correct, you know, a jump to say 600 is a 50% increase, right?

[00:17:24] So that's okay for me.

[00:17:27] Probably where I would stick around in the sixes.

[00:17:29] He's going to get offers.

[00:17:30] There are definitely going to be clubs.

[00:17:32] There's going to be clubs throwing sevens, eights at him.

[00:17:35] But again, we can't afford to get in those bidding wars, right?

[00:17:38] So then you say to yourself, is it better to go with an Akko at, you know, substantially less than that?

[00:17:44] Yeah.

[00:17:45] But then again, what does that actually do to your roster and all that type of stuff?

[00:17:48] And then spending that extra 300 on elsewhere.

[00:17:50] Because when you look at the guys who've got off contract, there's going to be some tough decisions to be made

[00:17:55] if people are making big jumps in their money.

[00:17:58] But again, I have full faith in the Sharks because Mooney has built quality rosters for us for a really long time.

[00:18:03] And I think if you look at the off contract list of players, we've probably got one of the best lists of players coming off contract this year.

[00:18:11] But again, he's the guy that assembled that, right?

[00:18:14] So I've got full faith that we'll make the right decisions.

[00:18:16] If you go Akko in and Trindle out, unfortunately, that puts a lot of pressure on the current other half.

[00:18:22] And he's already feeling the pressure.

[00:18:25] And I'm not suggesting he can't feel it.

[00:18:27] I'm not suggesting he shouldn't be up for that.

[00:18:29] If that's what it is, that's what it is.

[00:18:31] I think he kind of revel in it, to be honest.

[00:18:33] But that's another consideration.

[00:18:35] The pressure you're going to put on Hines to sort of run the show.

[00:18:38] And I've said it a few times, I wasn't sure how that Tricky and Niko combination actually looks at it best.

[00:18:47] We've now started to see that a few times this year, right?

[00:18:50] So they've played together now for two seasons.

[00:18:54] My preference is absolutely to keep Tricky.

[00:18:57] I don't want to make it sound like I'm not going to get into a bidding war for him.

[00:19:00] I would.

[00:19:01] But again, it has to be a number in your head or in the Sharks head where we sort of say we can't go past this, right?

[00:19:08] And unfortunately, that gap might be a lot higher for another team to go really high on him just because there is not a lot of quality NRL halves off contract.

[00:19:20] You know, there's even Cody Walker at South Sydney, right?

[00:19:23] So South will probably have to replace him with somebody.

[00:19:25] And we know Wayne Bennett loves signings and sugar hits.

[00:19:28] You know, he's not there to develop players.

[00:19:30] He wants to win in that window.

[00:19:31] So potentially they could be in the mix.

[00:19:32] I don't want to scare Sharks fans because we're both telling you that you shouldn't be.

[00:19:36] But there are a number of clubs that can come in and do a job on Trindle and do it overnight.

[00:19:42] And that would only happen if Trindle was open to that, of course.

[00:19:46] And I'm not suggesting he is or his manager is.

[00:19:49] But if he wants the big bucks, there's a few clubs that would definitely take the bait.

[00:19:55] And we're not probably going to play with those guys, I don't think, because it would just damage the team too much.

[00:20:05] And we can have the fans crying out and saying, yeah, but he's our best player.

[00:20:09] It's like, well, this is the circumstance, you know, and sometimes it's hard to control that circumstance.

[00:20:15] Cade Dykes played two NRL games in 2022.

[00:20:18] A lot of really bad injuries off contract.

[00:20:23] Potentially a really great player if he can stay on the field.

[00:20:27] Slightly versatile and he could play halves, he could play fullback.

[00:20:31] Probably a few other positions if you really wanted to.

[00:20:33] Very naturally talented footballer.

[00:20:36] Excelled at junior levels.

[00:20:38] Gone pretty good at cup level.

[00:20:40] What are you thinking about Cade?

[00:20:42] He's only going to be 23 next season, right?

[00:20:45] So again, he's super young.

[00:20:48] So it's still probably a little bit early for us to kind of give up on him, is my first thoughts.

[00:20:54] There's also too, the fact that, you know, he has had injuries in 22, 23 and 24.

[00:21:00] That's really unfortunate.

[00:21:02] This was a guy that had Wayne Bennett when he was doing the Dolphins offering the starting fullback spot.

[00:21:08] You know, Gus was the same, was calling him saying, you can come be the fullback for the Bulldogs.

[00:21:12] And he stuck with us and he wanted to make it work because of, you know, the legacy that his family has with the Sharks.

[00:21:17] So again, I would love to see him fit.

[00:21:19] I think he could be that potential X factor player for us.

[00:21:23] And maybe he could fill into the Akko role if Akko is to move on.

[00:21:27] We need to get him fit.

[00:21:28] But again, he just hasn't had a lot of football because before 22, 21 and 20 with the COVID years,

[00:21:34] with the lower grades, we weren't really playing much football at all.

[00:21:36] Right? So, you know, going into 25, it's really going to be not a lot of football in his system over the last five years.

[00:21:42] But we saw it this year when he played in his South Wales Cup.

[00:21:45] Like he was dominant there and, you know, try assists, scoring tries.

[00:21:48] So again, he's not going to break the bank for us.

[00:21:51] He's still young.

[00:21:52] He has tremendous upside, tremendous potential.

[00:21:54] I think we should be able to keep him on another 12 month deal.

[00:21:57] Yeah. And there wouldn't be a lot of clubs chasing him for extraordinary money.

[00:22:03] Like those people you mentioned might actually give him a shot, like a Wayne Bennett, a Gus Gould.

[00:22:08] They're the sort of sort of chief head honchos that would take a risk on a guy who's had injury

[00:22:12] because they've been around for so long.

[00:22:14] They know that they can come good.

[00:22:16] Other sort of younger admins or a bit more just not as skilled admins might go,

[00:22:23] oh, it's too risky.

[00:22:24] But I mean, he could come good now and not get another injury his whole life.

[00:22:28] So it's interesting when you say if we keep Atkinson or not, I think if Atkinson's let go,

[00:22:33] he could be the new fill in guy.

[00:22:36] So definitely can fill a role there at the very worst.

[00:22:40] The monster, the man amongst monsters weighing 114 kilograms.

[00:22:46] He's 196 centimeters tall.

[00:22:48] He is Chukuhai Tapua.

[00:22:51] What are you thinking here?

[00:22:52] I'd love to keep him.

[00:22:53] I think the growth that we saw over the last 12 months has definitely shown why Fitzy has so much faith in him.

[00:23:00] And Fitzy hasn't gone and signed a lot of players, especially from the Roosters, right?

[00:23:04] So for him to bring him across from the Roosters obviously shows how much he valued him before they even got him to the Sharks.

[00:23:12] I think he could be a casualty of our forward pack.

[00:23:15] You know, we do have a lot of front rowers right now and he is going to be worth more to other clubs, right?

[00:23:22] I know he loves the Sharks.

[00:23:23] He loves, you know, he's talked about how he actually feels like a first grader now and how he actually feels like a part of the club and he loves it.

[00:23:30] And, you know, I've seen him down, you know, at Woolaware Bay, you know, quite often.

[00:23:33] And, you know, he's a huge human, mate.

[00:23:36] So, you know, I'd love to keep him.

[00:23:38] But I think if I am a club like that is in that middle of the table and I'm looking for somebody that can give me some impact,

[00:23:46] I'm looking for somebody that can help change the way my forward pack looks from a size perspective and body shape,

[00:23:51] he'd be at the top of my list if I'm another club.

[00:23:54] So I think him and Hazleton, Hazleton will be the preference.

[00:24:00] But probably the pay gap there is again, a little bit different, right?

[00:24:04] So I would expect Hazleton would get a bit more cash than Tuku.

[00:24:09] But then you kind of look at it and you sort of say, well, if we give Tuku the opportunities that we give Hazleton,

[00:24:15] what does that look like?

[00:24:17] There's a lot of tough decisions here, mate.

[00:24:19] It might sound a bit weird, but I'm a huge fan of Tuku.

[00:24:24] I want to keep him if we're going to use him, if we're not going to use him.

[00:24:29] I just don't think having a guy like that as a depth player, I don't know if this is going to come out weird or not,

[00:24:36] but I just don't think it's worth...

[00:24:37] I'm not saying for the better of his career or whatever.

[00:24:40] Like he's not my mate.

[00:24:41] I don't, you know, club first.

[00:24:43] But if you're not going to use a guy like that, it seems like a bit of a waste.

[00:24:49] Now, he's going to find his feet.

[00:24:51] He's played 13 NRL games, 10 for us off the bench, all pretty limited stints.

[00:24:56] He's gone well and big potential.

[00:24:59] But if we're not going to use him and if that forward depth is just too good and he's at the back

[00:25:04] and it's going to cost us a little bit of money, I'd let him go.

[00:25:07] If it's going to cost us no money, sure.

[00:25:10] Absolutely keep him for depth.

[00:25:11] But I look at him and go, you should be in three or four years time, one of the best forwards in the game.

[00:25:17] Realistic or not, that's just what I'm thinking, just because of that body you have.

[00:25:22] Yeah.

[00:25:23] And if we think we can get him there, happy days.

[00:25:26] If we can't, if he's just going to be a cup player, I don't really need to keep him.

[00:25:31] Yeah.

[00:25:31] So I guess what you're saying is we have a, you know, a ton of middles, right?

[00:25:36] And so what's the real point of spending, you know, a couple hundred thousand dollars potentially

[00:25:41] on a guy who could be spending a lot of time in New South Wales Cup

[00:25:44] and then when we do put him in first grade, might be only playing 10, 15 minutes type stuff, right?

[00:25:49] Whereas you look at a Hazo who might do 50 minutes.

[00:25:52] There's also, there's also some, some kids coming through the lower grades, not ready at all,

[00:25:59] but we'll get to the 2Q stage of being able to play 10 minutes at a time,

[00:26:04] either late next year or the year after.

[00:26:06] And they would be on much less money than 2Q, even though 2Q is not on much money.

[00:26:10] You know, when you're a kid and you've got a bunch of toys and your parents tell you that you have to share.

[00:26:14] Oh yeah.

[00:26:15] I feel like that is how I feel like with this roster that we've got.

[00:26:19] And I want to get better and I want to add in more players,

[00:26:22] but I don't really like the idea of losing any of these guys, if I'm honest.

[00:26:27] But again, we do have to make changes, especially if we don't get the job done next year.

[00:26:33] This year, their squad's been together for four years, right?

[00:26:35] So it's time for a refresh.

[00:26:37] We need to cycle in new players.

[00:26:38] We need to cycle in new perspectives and all that type of stuff.

[00:26:41] So 2Q could potentially be a sacrificial lamb to do that.

[00:26:47] All right.

[00:26:48] Tall Tom Hazleton, he's played 44 games now.

[00:26:51] He played 25 last year, started 10 of those, had a pretty good season.

[00:26:56] We know he had a couple of games there where he was looking a bit busted,

[00:26:58] but that's just, that's natural.

[00:27:00] That's normal for a younger player in that position, especially came good at the end of the year again.

[00:27:05] We want to keep him, right?

[00:27:07] Yeah.

[00:27:07] I guess my question to you is, now we have Fanua Blake.

[00:27:11] Where do you rank Hazleton in terms of our top front rollers, right?

[00:27:17] So give me like your top four front rollers at the Sharks for next year.

[00:27:21] So I've got Fanua Blake at one.

[00:27:24] I think if fully fit, if fully fits, there's a massive disclaimer there.

[00:27:29] Then I've got Hamlin, Hamlin Newerley, if fully fit.

[00:27:32] I then would have a Kafusi.

[00:27:35] I then have a Rudolph.

[00:27:37] I'd then have Hazleton not far behind Rudolph.

[00:27:41] That kind of vibe.

[00:27:42] Yeah.

[00:27:42] Yeah.

[00:27:43] So I guess the reason I asked that question is because again, when it's coming down to dollars and cents, you know,

[00:27:47] Hazleton would be a prime candidate for a big upgrade, right?

[00:27:51] And there will be clubs throwing cash at him and offering him kind of, you know, maybe a three or a two spot in terms of their depth chart in the front row.

[00:28:02] Right.

[00:28:02] I don't think a club's going to say, right, well, he's our number one front row.

[00:28:05] But I think a lot of clubs would say, you know, he could be a Robin to a Batman or something like that.

[00:28:10] Right.

[00:28:10] Because again, he's got the intangibles.

[00:28:11] He's got the size.

[00:28:12] He's got the work rate.

[00:28:14] He's a really good player.

[00:28:15] So I could see a world where if we can't get Hamlin Newerley fit, we give him a tap on the shoulder like Royce Hunt.

[00:28:25] Just, you know, Royce Hunt left the Sharks with a year left on his contract.

[00:28:29] I do agree that if Hunt is fully fit, he's our second best front row.

[00:28:33] Hamlin Newerley.

[00:28:34] Sorry.

[00:28:35] Hamlin Newerley.

[00:28:36] Yep.

[00:28:36] It's one of those mornings for me.

[00:28:39] So I could see a world where we can't keep Hazleton just because we have done those investments in other players.

[00:28:47] So again, Toby and Hamlin Newerley will both be able to talk to other clubs on November 1st next year.

[00:28:55] So effectively, you could get a situation where one of those guys gets a tap on the shoulder and sort of says, look, this is not working out the way we thought it was going to work out.

[00:29:03] You might be able to get yourself a two, three, four year deal somewhere else.

[00:29:06] You should maybe look at it.

[00:29:08] I'm not saying that I want that to happen or I think it's going to happen.

[00:29:11] But I think that is something that in terms of moving parts with a Hazleton, Hazleton, I think would want to be a number three or a number two on a depth chart.

[00:29:21] And again, we need to have Confucius contract and we'll touch on him too.

[00:29:25] It's just so unfortunate that he's coming off contract at this point in time where we won't get to see him work with Fennell Blake and what that new rotation looks like because I'm really interested to see that.

[00:29:37] And we might, he might have signed a contract before round one next season and we might only get 20 games of it. Right.

[00:29:44] So I would love to keep Hazleton.

[00:29:47] Again, I don't want him to go anywhere else.

[00:29:49] It's just going to come down to how do we make that work.

[00:29:52] So Hamlin and Newerley in particular, as well as Rudolph, they're on really good money for what they do.

[00:29:57] So that's also interesting that the club might want to free up some cash there if the relationship isn't working.

[00:30:05] Again, we want those guys delivering and doing their best and all that type of stuff.

[00:30:09] And I think Fennell is going to help them as well.

[00:30:11] But I think when you look at a guy like Hazleton with his age and size and he's such a popular figure, I could see a world where we start to say, look, we need to, we've got too many middles, right?

[00:30:24] And we need to spend this money on other positions.

[00:30:26] And maybe we have too many middles because we never had that Fennell Blake, that alpha, that dominant, you know, guy.

[00:30:33] We needed to kind of just throw a storm of these huge guys.

[00:30:37] And we saw it past this season.

[00:30:38] It was really working.

[00:30:39] We would just flood the middle with these huge humans and, you know, we would get a roll on.

[00:30:43] So, look, potentially that could be something.

[00:30:46] But again, we re-signed Hamlin Newerley after we signed Fennell Blake, right?

[00:30:51] So, we obviously knew that this was coming and there's obviously a plan to it.

[00:30:55] Maybe we didn't factor in the growth of Hazleton, but these contracts that we've got for the guys that are going to be here still, like the Tobys and Hamlin Newerleys, they might be on good coin, but they're movable contracts.

[00:31:06] They're not as if they're on five-year deals or something like that.

[00:31:08] And we're kind of stuck there and we're going to have to let young players go, right?

[00:31:12] I think if we see the need, we could probably create some room to keep a guy like Hazleton.

[00:31:17] So, Oregon Cthusi is off our list because he's sticking around.

[00:31:21] So, we'll...

[00:31:22] But he's off.

[00:31:22] So, he's sticking around for next year.

[00:31:24] He's still...

[00:31:24] I can still talk.

[00:31:26] ...to be able to talk for 26, right?

[00:31:28] Okay.

[00:31:28] So, I look at the style of front rowers that we have and his style is the most different to a Fennell Blake's, a Toby's, a Hamlin Newerleys, right?

[00:31:37] So, again, he has a certain play for us, a certain style.

[00:31:40] But again, what are we going to do with Hazleton, right?

[00:31:44] So...

[00:31:44] Well, as we always do, let's get back to 2016.

[00:31:48] Are we suggesting that Fennell Blake is Fafita and potentially Cthusi is a prior?

[00:31:54] I could see that, yeah.

[00:31:55] I mean, I think from a defensive standpoint, Cthusi in that prior mold definitely fits.

[00:32:01] I think prior had some games where he would just go ballistic running the ball.

[00:32:06] That was just like...

[00:32:07] He was just like a man possessed sometimes.

[00:32:09] Although, to be fair, that was late in his career.

[00:32:11] Yeah, yeah.

[00:32:12] Like real late.

[00:32:13] I think he got dropped.

[00:32:14] I think he got dropped by Flano and then he came back and he was just a completely different player and was one of my favorites.

[00:32:20] Even though he was like a premiership winner, he came to us, you know, not with the greatest, I would say, back catalog.

[00:32:27] So, all I'm saying is it's not unheard of for a shark prop, let alone any other prop to come good later in the years.

[00:32:36] And Cthusi is probably not even halfway there yet, so...

[00:32:40] Yeah, and Cthusi was a really dominant player in the juniors for Parramatta.

[00:32:44] So, they had a decision to make it the Eagles a few years ago.

[00:32:47] Do they keep him or Stefano who is now going to the Melbourne Storm, right?

[00:32:51] And they chose Cthusi because, again, they thought that this was the guy that they wanted to back.

[00:32:56] And again, Fitzy doesn't sign many players from the outside.

[00:32:59] So, it speaks volumes that one of the first guys he went for was Cthusi, right?

[00:33:04] So, I think he does a lot of work for us.

[00:33:06] I think he's underrated.

[00:33:07] I think, again, I would love to keep him.

[00:33:11] But I just, I don't know where...

[00:33:13] I don't know the jumping contract versus the current one.

[00:33:17] And I don't know how many other clubs would be interested in him.

[00:33:20] I know a lot of clubs would be, but I don't know if he's going to go get that ridiculous money off off to go play somewhere else.

[00:33:26] So, I think we could probably keep him on modest money.

[00:33:28] See, I think a Hazleton would get more money somewhere else.

[00:33:31] But Cthusi probably wouldn't.

[00:33:34] And also too, the one thing I'm thinking about here is the jumps in contract values, right?

[00:33:38] That's what I mean.

[00:33:38] So, let's say Cthusi's on, yeah.

[00:33:40] So, you say Cthusi's on 400 and then he gets to say 450 or something like that, right?

[00:33:45] It's not a big jump, but Hazleton might be on like 200 and then he could be going to 500 or 450 or whatever the case is, right?

[00:33:52] So, yeah, it's a tough one.

[00:33:53] We spoke about this guy last week, so we'll keep it brief, but Will Kennedy.

[00:34:28] And if there's realistic expectations for us to go out and buy something like that, I think it's going to have to come down to how much faith do we have in a young guy like Aysen or somebody else at the club?

[00:34:39] And then also factoring in, you know, what does that do to our premiership window that we're in right now with just spending all that money on a 30-year-old front rower?

[00:34:47] You might not have the patience to go and develop a fullback.

[00:34:51] But the one thing that throws a spanner in the mix here is you look at the way this whole contract situation works and players could come available that are not in the market right now, right?

[00:35:04] So, every NRL club has great fullbacks at the moment.

[00:35:08] There's fullbacks of freaks at the moment, right?

[00:35:12] So you might find a guy who is getting pushed out of his current club because they have a boom youngster coming through, right?

[00:35:18] Like a Falunco at the Storm or something like that, right?

[00:35:21] So, you know, maybe that's how we do it.

[00:35:24] That's how we got Faneuil Blake.

[00:35:26] Like Faneuil Blake was not off contract.

[00:35:27] He was not a possibility.

[00:35:28] He forced his way out of his club and we got, you know, the best signing of the off-season, I think.

[00:35:33] So I think Kennedy is probably the one guy I'm looking to sort of say we need a change.

[00:35:39] And unfortunately, you know, I think it's going to have to be Will that moves on.

[00:35:43] But I say that and I'll be so happy to keep him, but I just don't see the players in the player pool that we could sign to replace him.

[00:35:54] So that then goes, all right, well, what does the contract look like there?

[00:35:59] And also it says to me, what do we see Akko as potentially a fullback?

[00:36:05] And then what does that look like as well, right?

[00:36:07] So then we could potentially have Akko, Trindle and Niko all in the spine together.

[00:36:12] Niko can't play fullback.

[00:36:13] He doesn't have the legs for it anymore.

[00:36:15] So I...

[00:36:16] I don't hate it.

[00:36:17] Yeah, I just, I think it's a huge off-season for Kennedy because that is the position that's probably under the most threat.

[00:36:23] And we might go to Akko and say, hey mate, you've got a whole pre-season to train back at fullback.

[00:36:28] You've spent time there in the past.

[00:36:29] We will determine your contract value on what we think you would be as a starting fullback and do the same thing with Will.

[00:36:36] But then you also are rocking the card a lot.

[00:36:38] Yeah, there's a lot of people out there suggesting the same thing that you're suggesting.

[00:36:44] All we're going to say about that is don't come crying to us in round 10 when we're 2 and 8 because the system has been rocked.

[00:36:53] I'm not saying we will be, not saying we will be, but it's a massive risk.

[00:36:58] That's all I'm going to say.

[00:36:59] Look at the Knights this year, right?

[00:37:00] So they had a new guy come in, it was actually O'Sullivan who came into the Knights.

[00:37:05] And basically he looked at their player contracts and sort of said, these values are way off and we need to start moving players on.

[00:37:12] And their whole season was disrupted.

[00:37:14] They linked into the finals, but they didn't really do anything.

[00:37:17] And now all the noise is around like what are they doing with Braille?

[00:37:20] What are they doing with Hastings?

[00:37:21] What are they doing with Adam Elliott?

[00:37:22] Like that's not the place that you want to be, right?

[00:37:25] And especially because it's such a connected group and these guys have been together since SG Ball in a lot of cases.

[00:37:33] It really does throw a spatter in the works.

[00:37:35] But again, when I look at Will, I look at what's the market for Will.

[00:37:39] I think, you know, clubs like the Dragons would be interested.

[00:37:42] They don't seem to have nailed down their full back.

[00:37:44] I saw Flano talk around Val who's going to be a center for them.

[00:37:48] So there's a couple of clubs that would probably be interested in Will,

[00:37:51] but I don't think Will is going to get an offer that blows us out of the water.

[00:37:55] So I think that gives us a little bit of freedom and flexibility to work out what we're doing with the Trindles,

[00:38:00] the Quarters and all that other type of stuff before we address the Will situation.

[00:38:04] But again, this could famously blow up in our face.

[00:38:07] Now, led to believe Cam McInnes will sign a two year deal.

[00:38:10] I heard that as well.

[00:38:12] That leaves Molotalo, Nikara, Stone Street and Wilton who we haven't spoken about.

[00:38:21] We've mentioned Ronnie last week.

[00:38:24] Stone Street will be re-signed.

[00:38:26] That leaves us to discuss, because we need to get a move on with our mornings, unfortunately.

[00:38:32] That leaves us to discuss Nikara and Wilton, two pretty key important pieces to our pack, obviously, either side.

[00:38:41] And one of those guys is going to be demanding a lot of money.

[00:38:44] And that is the best hole runner in the game, Britton Nikara.

[00:38:48] Let's jump to Teague Wilton.

[00:38:49] Do you think there's a demand out there for Teague Wilton?

[00:38:51] And what are you doing with Teague Wilton?

[00:38:53] I look at a club like the Raiders and think to myself, well, he's from the South Coast.

[00:38:58] He was in their catchment.

[00:39:00] I think he tried out for their SG ball, didn't make it or something like that along the lines.

[00:39:06] I think they could be a real hunter for him.

[00:39:09] And going for him, I look at, you know, even again, just because of the South Coast stuff, the Storm, could they move some pieces around and try and pick him up?

[00:39:16] Imagine him in the Storm.

[00:39:17] The Knights, yeah, the Knights have a ton of players off contract.

[00:39:21] Uncle John Morris at the Tigers.

[00:39:23] Yeah, Johnny Morris at the Tigers.

[00:39:25] That's a really good point as well.

[00:39:26] The Tigers always need back rowers.

[00:39:28] They're potentially going to be moving on Bateman, you know, sooner rather than later.

[00:39:32] So again, that's going to create some salary cap room and a position there for them.

[00:39:37] The Eels, you know, Riles is going to be in there aggressively looking to sign players and move things on.

[00:39:43] He's already, you know, giving Guthrie the tap on the shoulder.

[00:39:45] They've got Cartwright off contract, off Angale.

[00:39:49] So they've got a few guys there that were probably on some decent coin that they might look to move on.

[00:39:54] Can I just throw a hot take at you, by the way?

[00:39:55] I'm getting Fitzy vibes from Riles.

[00:39:58] Young coach, not going to cop any, you know, but do it respectfully.

[00:40:02] But he's not mucking around.

[00:40:05] Just putting it out there.

[00:40:06] I agree.

[00:40:07] I think he's going to be, I think there's going to be a lot of change at the Eels and, you know, they desperately need it.

[00:40:13] Jeez, the Bulldogs have a ton of players off contract too, and they're always in the market for players.

[00:40:17] So I do see there is a market for Teague.

[00:40:20] And I think any club that's in for Teague is probably going to be in for the Cora as well.

[00:40:24] I know they play a different size of the field.

[00:40:26] The thing with Britt is, surely that's a do not release stamp on his contract, no matter what.

[00:40:32] Man, Britt to me is the first guy I would sign.

[00:40:36] I love him so much.

[00:40:37] I think, you know, I think we'll have a really good chance of keeping him.

[00:40:41] Again, he's got a couple of kids, family's now in the Shire and all that type of stuff, right?

[00:40:45] So I can't see too much change coming for him.

[00:40:49] But there will be clubs that will throw the kitchen sink.

[00:40:51] Absolutely.

[00:40:52] And again, he does have a young family.

[00:40:53] So like the Raiders, for example, the Warriors, anyone's going to be in.

[00:40:57] But he's already on good money with us.

[00:41:00] That'll improve.

[00:41:01] Now, obviously we can't go nutso.

[00:41:03] I get that.

[00:41:04] But I think along with Trindle, he's the one you're keeping.

[00:41:08] Because everyone else is kind of replaceable at the moment.

[00:41:11] So let Ronnie go, will income Stone Street.

[00:41:15] Let Will go, massive risk.

[00:41:16] But we have an Atkinson there, potentially an Isen in time.

[00:41:21] Second rowers coming through the system.

[00:41:23] No one's really ready unless I'm getting it horribly wrong.

[00:41:27] There's a couple of guys in the 20s, but they are going to need a bit more seasoning, a bit more time before they're ready to be caught on week to week.

[00:41:35] But yeah, Nakora, I think is the one that we need to lock down.

[00:41:39] I did see a list and who knows if these lists are correct, but it had like the top 10 or 15 paid back rowers in the game.

[00:41:45] And he wasn't on there.

[00:41:47] Who?

[00:41:47] So that tells Nakora.

[00:41:49] What?

[00:41:51] Yeah.

[00:41:52] So again, who knows if these things are real?

[00:41:54] That's not right.

[00:41:54] But you look at contracts that Olu Kowatu got like 800,000, what Josh Schuster got, and then that got torn up and all that type of stuff.

[00:42:03] But there will be clubs that will throw a ridiculous amount of money at Nakora especially.

[00:42:08] But then I would say right behind that would be Wilton because again, Wilton's got a really good junior resume on him as well.

[00:42:14] You know, under 20s captain for New South Wales.

[00:42:18] We're huge T guys here.

[00:42:20] But I think there is a bit of a gap between what each player brings to the team week in, week out.

[00:42:27] Say that respectfully.

[00:42:28] And I think we need Wilton to assist.

[00:42:32] I'd love them both.

[00:42:33] Just putting it out there.

[00:42:34] Yeah.

[00:42:34] And I think we do keep both of them.

[00:42:37] But again, I think the contracts would have to be staggered.

[00:42:41] I don't want a situation where they're both coming off contract again at the same time.

[00:42:45] Like so now we've got Katoa and Ronnie going off at different times.

[00:42:48] It's a bit of a pickle, isn't it?

[00:42:49] Last time they came off together.

[00:42:50] Yeah.

[00:42:51] So I think that's a lot better way to do things.

[00:42:53] And that would make me feel a lot more comfortable if they weren't coming off at the same time.

[00:42:57] So, geez, it's a tough one, mate.

[00:43:00] But my preference is keep both those guys.

[00:43:03] And those guys with Trindle would be the first three that I look to lock down.

[00:43:06] Yeah, that's fair.

[00:43:07] I don't mind that idea at all.

[00:43:09] And because, you know, if you lose Hazelton, which we don't want it, but if you do, there's middles around for us.

[00:43:15] If you lose a winger, there's a winger coming through.

[00:43:17] There's things around.

[00:43:18] But the second rowers and the halves, yeah.

[00:43:21] Nephi Peru's going to be a solid backup.

[00:43:23] He's New South Wales Cup Player of the Year, etc.

[00:43:27] He's not going to be your starter week in, week out, unless something happens in the coming years and maybe he gets universally better.

[00:43:33] I don't know.

[00:43:33] But at the moment, he's a backup at best.

[00:43:36] Hasn't played in NRL.

[00:43:37] Well, Riley Pollard, we think, could have a great career at NRL, but he's still a year away at least, if not more.

[00:43:45] And how many of those youngsters have we seen, right?

[00:43:48] Yeah.

[00:43:49] Yeah.

[00:43:49] That have come through in the 20s, look like superstars and all that type of stuff.

[00:43:53] And they've signed this guy long term.

[00:43:55] And then, you know, it gets to the point where they don't actually kick on and do other things.

[00:44:00] So hopefully that doesn't happen here.

[00:44:02] But, you know, we just had Tomoko.

[00:44:05] Is that how you say his last name?

[00:44:07] He's a guy that we'd signed on in the first grade squad for, I think, the last two seasons from like a 17 year old.

[00:44:13] Didn't get the NRL spot just yet.

[00:44:15] And also too, we just announced the re-signing of a bunch of, you know, five different players.

[00:44:20] His name wasn't on that list.

[00:44:21] So I don't know if he's going to be with us moving forward or not.

[00:44:23] But that's just an example of, you know, sometimes you don't always get it right.

[00:44:27] All right, Kieran, we've got to bounce because life is moving on.

[00:44:30] But thanks for your time this morning.

[00:44:32] Good to get some November 1 goss out of you.

[00:44:35] And we'll see what happens November 1.

[00:44:37] We'll see what happens.

[00:44:38] We'll report back when we can, possibly next week.

[00:44:41] And we'll see what's going on there with signings.

[00:44:45] It's quite fascinating.

[00:44:47] And it's unfortunate that all our guys are off at the same time.

[00:44:50] It's just how it's gone down.

[00:44:53] And it's unfortunate that there's fans.

[00:44:54] We have to go through this baloney of, you know, a guy signing years in advance for another team.

[00:45:00] Anyway, you know how we feel about that.

[00:45:02] Imagine watching, say, like, imagine watching Ronnie all season next year and he signed with like the West Tigers.

[00:45:07] Like that's going to be just ridiculous, you know?

[00:45:09] That would suck.

[00:45:10] That's the first mistake he makes.

[00:45:12] Mate, get out of here.

[00:45:13] Oh, and you know too.

[00:45:14] And you know as well, like, the crowd would give it to him and then he'd be pointing back at the fans.

[00:45:18] And it's like, we love Ronnie.

[00:45:20] That's right.

[00:45:21] We do.

[00:45:21] If he does have to leave, like, let him leave respectfully.

[00:45:25] Absolutely.

[00:45:25] Let him leave in a quick manner.

[00:45:27] Absolutely.

[00:45:27] Don't drag it out.

[00:45:28] Like, there is so much potential to rock the boat next year.

[00:45:31] I'll tell you what, when you and I are in Vegas next year, we need to get Volandis, get him off the craps table,

[00:45:37] and we'll go have a beverage with him and we'll tell him how to run the player market.

[00:45:41] That's for sure.

[00:45:41] I've got ideas.

[00:45:42] I've got a lot of problem with you people and you're all going to hear about it.

[00:45:45] We'll talk to you soon, Shark House fans.

[00:45:48] Thanks a lot for listening.

[00:45:49] Appreciate you all.

[00:45:50] We're going to try and get some more episodes out for you this week.

[00:45:52] See what happens.

[00:45:53] Stay tuned.

[00:45:55] Up up Cronulla.

[00:45:55] Have a good day, Kieran.

[00:45:56] Bye bye.

[00:45:57] Sharkies!

[00:45:58] Sharkies!

[00:45:59] And to all you people back in the Shire, turn your points lights off because we're coming home with a trophy.